The Doctor Who Discussion Thread

[Paul B]

Why.. last week, I believe. And look how much you loved that! I say kudos go the show for trying something different.

I thought this episode was one of the most original stories I've seen on the show, and that's one of the reasons I enjoyed it so much. Of course it retreads old story elements, but how can it not on a 50 year old show? It's all about the execution, in my eyes.

[Cake for Brains]

Yes, but I said when was the last time we got a really good Doctor vanquishes aliens romp?

And yes, fine, recycle elements that have been used before in the show's 50 year history; just don't recycle elements that have been used 5 times already this series.

[Paul B]

I guess I rated this episode more independently than you did - I was just so enthralled, and to me it didn't feel like a rehash as the positives far outweighed any conceivable negatives.

None of it felt contrived, a problem which has plagued every prior season finale, IMO.

[Cake for Brains]

I guess I rated this episode more independently than you did - I was just so enthralled, and to me it didn't feel like a rehash as the positives far outweighed any conceivable negatives.

None of it felt contrived, a problem which has plagued every prior season finale, IMO.

I didn't think it was contrived, just a bit like deja-vu! What score would you give it?

And is S6 your favourite Who series?

[Paul B]

I guess I rated this episode more independently than you did - I was just so enthralled, and to me it didn't feel like a rehash as the positives far outweighed any conceivable negatives.

None of it felt contrived, a problem which has plagued every prior season finale, IMO.

I didn't think it was contrived, just a bit like deja-vu! What score would you give it?

And is S6 your favourite Who series?

It gets a 9/10. I think almost everything about it was perfect, and the episode would make my top 10 (which I'll do tomorrow)

S6 isn't my favourite, no. Aside from the Moffat penned episodes and The Doctor's Wife, the rest simply wasn't consistent enough. S3 is probably my favourite in terms of overall consistency. I'd probably rank it something like,

3
6
4
1
5
2

[Cake for Brains]

I guess I rated this episode more independently than you did - I was just so enthralled, and to me it didn't feel like a rehash as the positives far outweighed any conceivable negatives.

None of it felt contrived, a problem which has plagued every prior season finale, IMO.

I didn't think it was contrived, just a bit like deja-vu! What score would you give it?

And is S6 your favourite Who series?

It gets a 9/10. I think almost everything about it was perfect, and the episode would make my top 10 (which I'll do tomorrow)

S6 isn't my favourite, no. Aside from the Moffat penned episodes and The Doctor's Wife, the rest simply wasn't consistent enough. S3 is probably my favourite in terms of overall consistency. I'd probably rank it something like,

3
6
4
1
5
2

I think I'd go 3, 4, 1, 2, 6
5

And one more question - then I'll stop, I promise - did you continue watching the 'classic' series?

[Paul B]

I tried to percivere and watch every episode, but I'm afraid I failed. It just wasn't the show I loved.

I will, however, pursue viewing the most highly regarded episodes sometime in the future - I feel I must.

[Cake for Brains]

I tried to percivere and watch every episode, but I'm afraid I failed. It just wasn't the show I loved.

I will, however, pursue viewing the most highly regarded episodes sometime in the future - I feel I must.

You must! Skip the black and white stuff.

[Cake for Brains]

We've not mentioned the ratings this year, so thought I'd post them.

The overnights are way down on previous years, though the timeshifts have been consistently enormous (higher than anything else on TV). The BBC3 repeats have bombed, but the iPlayer figures are very impressive (Doctor Who being the most watched programme on the service)

Series 6
The Impossible Astronaut - 6.5m overnight/8.9m final
Day of the Moon 5.4m overnight/7.3m final
The Curse of the Black Spot 6.1m overnight/7.9m final
The Doctor's Wife 5.9m overnight/8m final
The Rebel Flesh 5.7m overnight/7.4m final
The Almost People 5m overnight/6.7m final
A Good Man Goes to War 5.5m overnight/7.5m final (aired opposite Britain's Got Talent final)
Let's Kill Hitler 6.2m overnight/8.1m final
Night Terrors 5.5m overnight/7.1m final
The Girl Who Waited 6m overnight/7.6m final
The God Complex 5.2m overnight/6.8m final
Closing Time 5.3m overnight/TBA (probably about 6.9m)
The Wedding of River Song 6.1m overnight/TBA (probably a shade under 8m)

So not too bad - but the raw figures look underwhelming. DW is still a solid banker for the BBC - but I don't think it's quite the jewel in the crown it used to be.

[Hector]

I think I need to watch it again. I think if I had to pick a word to describe the finale it would be 'strange'. I liked it well enough, but I can't bring myself to feel completely satisifed. How many times must all the characters "die", forget each other, reunite in epic, funny timey-wimey ways... I think it's getting a bit old. I'd quite like a generic Doctor-vanquishes-aliens episode, because when was the last time we got a really good one of those, a good romp, if you will?

THIS. and "Strange" is probably the strongest compliment I would give this season. I don't that mean in a bad way (not entirely )

What did the ave ratings used to be? WHO, or the finales, used to feel a bit like X-Factor or Only Fools specials when it felt like an event for the entire country - even if you don't watch the shows you're well aware what's transpiring.

[Moon-Crane]

I'm with Paul. I loved that finale. I loved the 'strangeness' if you want to call it that. It actually had me thinking about both the unfolding episode and the previous S6 episode elements rather than just having it wash over me in a sea of bombast. That's not really a criticism of the RTD finales as i generally liked them, i just like the different approach, and I'll take more of this current trend for a season or two more.

Thankfully ratings mean absolutely nothing in regards to the relative quality of a show. It's no detriment to the show that figures appear down on previous years. I'd be interested in comparing the sharp divergence in the way people are watching tv shows in the last few years.

I'm intrigued by your perception of the show being such event tv, Hector. In my whole life i've never known Doctor Who finales to be anything like must watch tv (or be known about at all by people who don't watch the show) - even when the BBC were promoting the absolute hell out of it two or three seasons ago. Non-Who people, that i know, knowof the show, but couldn't tell you one thing about any of it, really, outside of it being 'some sci-fi nonsense' or that bloke in the telephone box. It's actually one of the sadnesses i have with sci-fi shows in general - that they don't get the credit they deserve with people who simply won't accept the genre.

Have to say i was surprised at the lack of any clip, whatsoever, for a Christmas Special at the end of the episode?

[Mr Blue Sky]

Just got around to seeing the finale (I had to prioritise Dexter and Breaking Bad, obviously) and I have to say I agree with both Paul and M-C. That was probably the best-written finale we've had; so intricately plotted. I loved all the little touches of humour (live chess! "You'll never make it to Bishop 4 alive" ) and callbacks to previous episodes.

Both Amy and the Doc continue to grow on me this season. I wasn't at all impressed during S5 but they've both grown into their roles this year and I'm looking forward to the Christmas special and S7 now when the tone will no doubt be a bit different.

It'd have been nice to see a snippet of the Chrimbo episode M-C, you're right. They must have filmed it by now?

[Moon-Crane]

Did anyone catch this article the other week about a possible DW film. I'd bookmarked it to mention, but then forgot about it until finding it again today.
Doctor Who 'to be made into Hollywood feature film'

David Yates, who directed the last four Harry Potter films, told Variety magazine he is working on developing a feature film with the BBC.

He said the film would take a fresh approach to the show, which first appeared on TV in 1963.

Yates said it would take "two to three years to get it right" as the show needs "quite a radical transformation".

I have to wonder why anyone who thinks the show needs "quite a radical transformation" would feel any need to make a big screen version?

I guess i'd take it as load of hot air for now.

[Paul B]

Cakey, circa series 5, may have been positively giddy over this news, but what about now?

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/tv/s7/docto ... eries.html

Makes me wonder what's the point in bringing them back at all, really. Their characters were left in a good place at the end of last series, and I felt they came full circle. I particularly warmed to Rory, and the TARDIS dynamic as a whole, so it would've been nice to keep them around a while longer.

[Cake for Brains]

Cakey, circa series 5, may have been positively giddy over this news, but what about now?

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/tv/s7/docto ... eries.html

Makes me wonder what's the point in bringing them back at all, really. Their characters were left in a good place at the end of last series, and I felt they came full circle. I particularly warmed to Rory, and the TARDIS dynamic as a whole, so it would've been nice to keep them around a while longer.

Well, Amy and Rory certainly grew on me during Season 6, but I think their story has been told now, to be honest. The show has always thrived on change, so I'm quite pleased that we'll get some new blood next series. And Amy is now the new series' longest-serving companion. Plus, I think Matt's Doctor could do with being paired with an older companion...

Something that does worry me about Series 7 though - Moffat is going in the complete opposite direction to Series 6, in that his vision of Series 7 is that it's going to be 13 standalone blockbusters. He says he's mapped it all out and at the moment there's not one story that he thinks needs to be a two-parter. Shame, because I really liked the arc driven nature of this year's stories.

Looking forward to Christmas anyway - I really loved last year's yuletide offering.

[Paul B]

Something that does worry me about Series 7 though - Moffat is going in the complete opposite direction to Series 6, in that his vision of Series 7 is that it's going to be 13 standalone blockbusters. He says he's mapped it all out and at the moment there's not one story that he thinks needs to be a two-parter. Shame, because I really liked the arc driven nature of this year's stories.

That's definitely disappointing. S6's arcs are what kick-started my interest and enthusiasm in the show again. And if the 'stand-alones' are anything like they were last series, I for one will not be as incensed to watch every week. It was inevitable though, your standard casual viewer is going to be switched off by complex stories requiring knowledge of past episodes. And it's all about pandering to the masses, sadly.

Thinking about it, S7 is getting to sound more and more like a 'reboot', much in the same vein as S5 was. Or you could argue that S5 and 6 were the 'transitional' series, and S7 will be where Moffat finally achieves his real vision for the show.

[Paul B]

Just a quick review, I'm starved...

This was definitely one for the kids. In that respect, it succeeded. It was Christmassy and adventurous. But obviously I'm not the target demographic, so I didn't enjoy it particularly much. It had a few solid moments, but the whole thing felt a bit aimless and unimaginative, with nothing we haven't seen before. I've never been a fan of the Doctor interacting with kids, which probably didn't help. It was nice to see Amy and Rory pop up at the end.

A Christmas Carol remains the superior Moffat-era special.

[Cake for Brains]

Just a quick review, I'm starved...

This was definitely one for the kids. In that respect, it succeeded. It was Christmassy and adventurous. But obviously I'm not the target demographic, so I didn't enjoy it particularly much. It had a few solid moments, but the whole thing felt a bit aimless and unimaginative, with nothing we haven't seen before. I've never been a fan of the Doctor interacting with kids, which probably didn't help. It was nice to see Amy and Rory pop up at the end.

A Christmas Carol remains the superior Moffat-era special.

Yeah, I agree with all that, really. I suppose you can get away with being overly sentimental at Christmas, but this didn't do anything for me. I liked the idea and it all looked very nice and snowy, but I far preferred last year's A Christmas Carol.

[Mr Blue Sky]

That was rubbish wasn't it. I had to turn it off after 20 minutes.

[Cake for Brains]

That was rubbish wasn't it. I had to turn it off after 20 minutes.

It wasn't that bad!

[Mr Blue Sky]

Just caught School Reunion and The Girl in the Fireplace from S2 on BBC3. Ages since I've seen them - TGITF holds up particularly well; that ending still packs a big emotional punch.

[Moon-Crane]

Just caught School Reunion and The Girl in the Fireplace from S2 on BBC3. Ages since I've seen them - TGITF holds up particularly well; that ending still packs a big emotional punch.

I'd say that's still my favourite episode.

[Cake for Brains]

Just caught School Reunion and The Girl in the Fireplace from S2 on BBC3. Ages since I've seen them - TGITF holds up particularly well; that ending still packs a big emotional punch.

I struggle to watch School Reunion these days after the death of Elisabeth Sladen last year. TGITF is probably still Moffat's best episode, though not quite one of my all-time favourite episodes.

[Paul B]

One hand giveth, the other hand taketh away...

Toby Whithouse has gone up in my estimation after "The God Complex", so I'm happy enough about that. But the writer of 42, Hungry Earth and Cold Blood? No thanks...

Moffat: hire better writers! Haven't you learnt anything from last year?

[Cake for Brains]

One hand giveth, the other hand taketh away...

Toby Whithouse has gone up in my estimation after "The God Complex", so I'm happy enough about that. But the writer of 42, Hungry Earth and Cold Blood? No thanks...

Moffat: hire better writers! Haven't you learnt anything from last year?

Let us just hope they've not given Chibnail a two-parter again. Glad to have Whithouse back again - the man can do no wrong as far as I'm concerned.